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David Icke's war on God?

 
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TonyGosling
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 18, 2007 3:09 am    Post subject: David Icke's war on God? Reply with quote

Oh dear now Babylon = Christianity

David Icke - Analysis of Christianity
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-8469389811298138021

David really must study history rather than making it up as he goes along.

Icke told me he doesn't believe Jesus ever existed at all. Christ was all just a big conspiracy. Now where have I heard that before...

Quote:
"Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world. By this you know the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is of God, and every spirit that does not confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is not of God. And this is the spirit of the Antichrist, which you have heard was coming, and is now already in the world. You are of God, little children, and have overcome them, because He who is in you is greater than he who is in the world. They are of the world. Therefore they speak as of the world, and the world hears them. We are of God. He who knows God hears us; he who is not of God does not hear us. By this we know the spirit of truth and the spirit of error."
1 John. 4:1-6, NKJV
http://www.bible.ca/ef/expository-1-john-4-1-6.htm


He's always on about satanic rituals but blind to Christ and just doesn't get the fact that the satanic always imitates the path of God's sacred son.

Just one example, you won't find 'Easter' in the Bible. It's passover.


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CJ
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2007 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While you and Icke disagree on one or two "fundamental" principals of Christianity. Surely the gaps between Freemasonary, the established church and a NWO dominated by elite Jews (not anti semite), would really make you and Icke best buddies....in context to the big picture?

Maybe I`m wrong, maybe its not my place to get involved. But it saddens me when two people are seeking common goals like "justice and truth" end up fighting. Its this type of conflict which the NWO uses on verious groups in its quest for global dominance.

Please kiss and make up.{:¬)
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 4:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't get me wrong, David has done loads of tremendous work, but on this crucial question he's up the creek.
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willow the wip
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 10:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

he is a false christ, I remember the terry show with him claming to be the son of God.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2007 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

willow the wip

I the traditional sense, we are all sons and daughters of God. I believe there`s much more to our existance, than current religions claim.
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2007 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

CJ wrote:
willow the wip

I the traditional sense, we are all sons and daughters of God. I believe there`s much more to our existance, than current religions claim.


I dissagree, we cannot all be sons and duaghters of God, the simple reson is that 1 I dont believe in a Mono-theistic religion, we do not obtain godhood, we are not Christ, as Ike clamed to be the messiah, though Icke got that wrong.

some would hold to the belief that men were created to be "gods", Is it in any sense Christian to speak of the "deification" of man -- to say that God created or redeemed man in order to become deity?

When you look at various religious groups who use such language today mean?

Are they all saying the same thing?

well I will explain

their are 3 forms of it

Monotheistic Deification

Polytheistic Deification

and Panentheistic Deification

well Monotheistic Deification means that men are "deified" in the sense that the Holy Spirit dwells within Christian believers and transforms them into the image of God in Christ, eventually endowing them in the resurrection with immortality and God's perfect moral character.

Polytheistic Deification means

Two examples of polytheistic doctrines of deification are the teachings of Mormonism and Armstrongism, although adherents of these religions generally do not admit to being polytheistic.

The Mormons are very explicit in their "scriptures" that there are many Gods; for example, the three persons of the Trinity are regarded as three "Gods." Since they believe that many Gods exist but at present worship only one -- God the Father -- at least one Mormon scholar has admitted with qualifications that their doctrine could be termed "henotheistic."

Henotheism is a variety of polytheism in which there are many gods, but only one which should be worshiped. Thus, the meaning of deification in Mormonism is radically different than that of the church fathers who used similar terms, despite Mormon arguments to the contrary.

The Worldwide Church of God of Herbert W. Armstrong (who died early in 1986) claims to believe in only one God. However, Armstrongism defines "God" as a collective term (like "church" or "family") referring to a family of distinct beings all having the same essential nature. Presently this "God family" consists of two members, God the Father and Christ, but it is their plan to reproduce themselves in human beings and so add millions or even billions to the God family. Therefore, by the normal use of the words on which our categorizations are based, Armstrong's world view is also polytheistic.


Therefore, by the normal use of the words on which our categorizations are based, Armstrong's world view is also polytheistic.


Panentheistic Deification Means

An important example of a panentheistic doctrine of deification within professing Christianity is Union Life, founded by Norman Grubb, who at one time was a respected evangelical leader. In 1980 CORNERSTONE, an evangelical magazine, ran an article arguing that Union Life was teaching pantheism or panentheism.

Union Life has attempted to argue that panentheism, unlike pantheism, is not heretical (despite Grubb's admission that he does not know the definition of pantheism! However, neither pantheism nor panentheism separates the creation from the essential nature of the Creator, though panentheism does posit a differentiation in which the creation is the expression of the Creator. The heretical nature of Union Life is made evident by such statements as, "there is only One Person in the universe," "everything is God on a certain level of manifestation," and "Nothing but God exists!"

Therefore, Union Life's claim to following the traditions of the church fathers is no more valid than that of the Mormons.


when you look at the issues that we are all sons of God

well Although men are never called "gods" in an affirmative sense in Scripture, believers in Christ are called "sons" or "children" of God (John 1:12; Rom. 8:14-23; Gal. 4:5-7; 1 John 3:1-2; etc.). Based on the assumption that sons are of the same nature as their father, some conclude that since believers are sons of God, they must also be gods. This reasoning is thought to be confirmed by those passages in John's writings which speak of believers as being "begotten" or "born" of God (John 1:13; 3:5-6; 1 John 2:29; 3:9; 4:7; 5:1,4,1Cool.

As convincing as this argument may seem, it actually goes beyond the Bible's teaching and is at best erroneous and at worse heretical. The above Scriptures do not mean that the "sonship" of believers is a reproduction of God's essence in man for the following reasons.

1) In one sense all human beings are God's "offspring" (Acts 17:2Cool, so that even Adam could be called God's "son" (Luke 3:3Cool; yet this cannot mean that human beings are gods or have the same nature as God, for the reasons already given in our analysis of the "image of God."

2) Paul speaks of our sonship as an "adoption" (Rom. 8:15,23; Gal. 4:5), which of course suggests that we are not "natural" sons of god.

3) John, who frequently speaks of Christians as having been "begotten" by God, also tells us that Jesus Christ is the "only-begotten" or "unique" Son of God (John 1:14,18; 3:16,18; 1 John 4:9). At the very least, this means that we are NOT sons of God in the same sense that Christ is the Son of God, nor will we ever be. Christ was careful to distinguish between His Sonship and that of His followers (e.g., John 20:17). For this reason Kenneth Copeland's assertion that "Jesus is no longer the only begotten Son of God" [22] must be regarded as false doctrine.

4) Finally, the New Testament itself always interprets the spiritual birth which makes believers sons, not as a conversion of men into gods, but as a renewal in the MORAL likeness of God, produced by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, and resulting in an intimate relationship with God as a Father who provides for His children's needs (Matt. 5:9,45; 6:8,10,32; 7:11,21; Rom. 8:14-17; Gal. 4:6-7; 1 John 2:29; 3:9; 4:7; 5:1-5).

The biblical doctrine that believers in Christ are children of God is a glorious teaching, to be sure, and what it means we do not yet fully know (1 John 3:2). But we do know something about what it means, as well as what it does not mean. It does mean eternal life with Christ-like holiness and love, in which the full potential of human beings as the image of God is realized. But it does not mean that we shall cease to be creatures, or that "human potential" is infinite, or that men shall become gods.


If we have union with Christ then we are adopted as Sons of God, so to answer your quesiton, no we are not all sons of the most high God.

we as believers are adopted sons of God is closely related to the doctrine of the spiritual union between Christ and Christian believers. This union is expressed both as a union between Christ and the individual believer and as a union of Christ and the church. Paul in particular teaches that Christians are "in Christ" (a phrase which occurs over 160 times in Paul's letters), "with Christ" in His death, burial, resurrection, and ascension (Rom. 6:3-8; Eph. 2:5-6), corporately the "body" of Christ (Rom. 12:4-5; 1 Cor. 12:12-27; Eph. 1:22-23; 4:12; Col. 1:1Cool, that they have Christ, dwelling within (Rom. 8:9-11; 1 Cor. 3:16; 6:17-20; 2 Cor. 13:5; Eph. 3:16-17), and that Christ Himself is their "life" (Gal. 2:20; Col. 3:4). On the basis of this teaching, many have concluded that Christians are in fact either a corporate extension of the Incarnation (as the church) or replications of the Incarnation (as individual Christians). Such a conclusion is often tied to the teaching of some concept of deification. The question is, does the Bible support such a conclusion?

As with the doctrine of Christians as the sons of God, such ideas go far beyond the teaching of Scripture. To say that believers are "in Christ" means that they are somehow spiritually united to Christ, not that they ARE Christ. When Paul says that we have been crucified, buried, raised, and ascended with Christ, he is not speaking literally, but means simply that by virtue of our legal identification and close spiritual relationship with Christ we benefit by His death and resurrection. The teaching that the church is the body of Christ is also not to be taken literally, and should not be pressed to imply that the church is Christ or even an essential part of Christ. That the relationship between Christ and the church involves a substantial union without the church becoming Christ is best seen in the figure of the church as the bride of Christ (Eph. 5:28-32): the bride is physically united to her husband, yet they remain distinct. The Spirit indwells the believer, to be sure, but the believer does not become divine as a result, any more than the temple under the old covenant became a part of God simply because His presence filled it (cf. 1 Cor. 3:17). Christ is our life, not in the sense that our individuality is replaced by His person, but in the sense that we have eternal and spiritual life through our union with Him.


Finally, the notion that each believer is somehow a duplicate of the Incarnation deserves a closer look. The rationale for this view is that an "incarnation" is defined as the indwelling of God in a human being; and since, we are told, this is as true of the Christian as it was of Christ, it follows that the Christian, as Kenneth Hagin puts it, "is as much an incarnation as was Jesus of Nazareth." [23] The error in this reasoning lies in the definition of "incarnation." Christ was not merely God dwelling in a human being, a heresy (known as Nestorianism) the early church condemned because it meant that the Word did not actually BECOME flesh (John 1:14) but only joined Himself to a human being. Rather, the incarnate Christ was one person in whom were perfectly united two natures, deity and humanity; the Christian is a person with one nature, human, in whom a separate person, God the Holy Spirit (and through Him, the Father and the Son as well), dwells.


Does Partaking Of The Divine Nature Make Us Gods?

In 2 Peter 1:4 we are told that through God's promises Christians may "become partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world by lust." This text, even more so than Psalm 82, has suggested to many a doctrine of deification. And indeed, if by deification one means simply "partaking of divine nature," then such "deification" is unquestionably biblical. The question, then, is what does Peter mean by "partakers of divine nature"?

Since the word "divine" is used earlier in the same sentence ("His divine power," verse 3), where it MUST mean "of God," "divine nature" must mean God's nature. The word "nature," however, should not be understood to mean "essence." Rather, as the context makes evident, Peter is speaking of God's moral nature or character. Thus Christians are by partaking of the divine nature to escape the corruption that is in the world because of sinful lust, and are instead to exhibit the moral attributes of Christ (cf. verses 5-11).


anyway that is my belief.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:59 pm    Post subject: David Icke is busting is the CHURCHES NOT THE RELIGION Reply with quote

Sad

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PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is why I joined his forums. Lots of stuff going on at David Ickes forum Very Happy

Recently a bunch of Freemasons joined and although it was a bit hard for the moderators I guess, then it surely helped give a better view on Freemasonry. A few good threads there.

I am browsing around on this forum a bit after getting to know Tony Gosling. Lots of interesting stuff going on here as well Cool

I saw both Tony and Icke give speeches in Totnes Razz

Oh, you started this thread Tony Smile I just noticed Davids name in the topic title.
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TonyGosling
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PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 1:04 am    Post subject: Re: David Icke is busting is the CHURCHES NOT THE RELIGION Reply with quote

Child-of-Light wrote:
Now what David Icke is busting is the CHURCHES NOT THE RELIGION.


Well the church is the people of God and it is Relationship with God not Religion which brings us close to Him.

So is David Icke's god the God of the Bible?

Of the Abrahamic tradition?

You can't go around making gods up left right and centre.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 4:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

>You can't go around making gods up left right and centre.

Quite so, although a reading of the Old Testament indicates a very large number of gods were sacrificed to by various peoples.

So how do we test whether a god is made up?

Do we read a book and hope the writers of the book met the god or met someone who met the god?

If we do not trust the Roman Church with its control of scriptures for over a millennium (burning of books etc), what should we do to satisfy ourselves that our god is real?

And if our god is real - since St Paul tells us that there are lords many and gods many, both in heaven and in earth - how do we determine that that god is the best to follow?

Read a book?
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 7:00 pm    Post subject: Re: David Icke is busting is the CHURCHES NOT THE RELIGION Reply with quote

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

>It's practices have hardy changed since babylon

I seem to recall St Augustine explaining that the Christian beliefs and rituals were so similar to those of ancient religions because Satan had copied them in advance

These days lack of classical education means that St Augustine's pathetic defence is no longer required
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:49 pm    Post subject: David Icke Reply with quote

Even David Icke did tremendous research, he is insisting that Jesus the Christ never existed... even not as a normal human being...

Why he is insisting on that is a real questions for me...

Why is he so insisting on a subject history is so clear about....

Does he have motifs which could be not so good in the end?

Either David Icke is to humble himself and accept Jesus as the Christ, or he will be in the end also a trap where lots of people will be deceived.

Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:50 pm    Post subject: David Icke Reply with quote

Even David Icke did tremendous research, he is insisting that Jesus the Christ never existed... even not as a normal human being...

Why he is insisting on that is a real questions for me...

Why is he so insisting on a subject history is so clear about....

Does he have motifs which could be not so good in the end?

Either David Icke is to humble himself and accept Jesus as the Christ, or he will be in the end also a trap where lots of people will be deceived.

Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
Gal 1:9 As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2010 2:52 pm    Post subject: Re: David Icke is busting is the CHURCHES NOT THE RELIGION Reply with quote

TonyGosling wrote:
Child-of-Light wrote:
Now what David Icke is busting is the CHURCHES NOT THE RELIGION.


Well the church is the people of God and it is Relationship with God not Religion which brings us close to Him.
I agree with Tony and David here.

But consider this:
Jesus Christ was not the only person that was crucified by the Romanists!
A well known history is on Spartacus, a slave from the Romanists, who was killed together with 5000 other slaves. The crosses where put on the Via Appia on the road to the Luciferian Capital of Antichrist, Rome. The difference between a Jewish donkey and a Roman pope mobile is evident.
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